Speaker: [00:00:00] All right. Hello everyone and welcome to Full Time to Travel Time. We have a very exciting guest today. Uh, someone we recently met at Travel Con and Kim, do you wanna introduce our awesome guest?
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, yes. We're joined by someone today who you can see if you're watching, who has literally traveled the world and without paying for it.
With cash at least. So Catherine Fann is a personal finance expert, journalist and public speaker with 10 years of industry experience. She began her career in tech before transitioning to journalism in 2015, and currently covers all things credit cards for business insiders, personal finance hub, and I know that you wrote for NerdWallet and I think the Points guy also, which we'll talk about a little bit.
But thanks to credit card travel rewards, Catherine has flown well over 1 million miles, visiting 44 countries across [00:01:00] all seven continents, which is awesome. She sailed with orcas and Antarctica. Flown home in first class from Japan, photographed a wedding at Hobbiton in New Zealand and gone on a safari in South Africa.
But her most meaningful trips always bring her home to loved ones in Taiwan. So thanks for joining us, Catherine Fan. How's it going? Good.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. We are jazz.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we're absolutely jazz. I loved meeting.
Speaker 3: Well, I loved meeting both of you so much at Travel Con. Yes. To anyone listening, pro tip, do what Kim and Isaac did.
Just go up and say hi to people. I was definitely in my own haze and they just came up and we're friendly and chatty as they are right here. And it goes such a long way toward making strangers into instant friends, and it's such a good tip also for travel in general. So well done you all. Thank you.
Speaker: Thank you. And it's actually a funny story in that like you were the host of Travel Con, right? So you were like the person who kicked it off. You came in with so much energy, empathy. Like we, we just loved your energy and throughout the whole [00:02:00] process you came in with so much energy and you were so like, like just so willing to meet people.
But we, we saw you like. Obviously kick it off. Then we were in the exclusive lounge and, and you were on your computer. Now Kim's much more of the outgoing of the two of us.
Speaker 2: I'm an extrovert
Speaker: and she was a bit like starstruck. 'cause like I saw you, I was like, let's go say hi. And she's like, oh, I don't know.
Like she's working on her computer. The host looks
Speaker 2: so focused on like what you were doing at your laptop too. Like you were in the zone and,
Speaker: and so Kim was like actually really shy, which was rare for me to see that. And so I was like, I was like, she's here, she wants to meet us. And so we went up and we said hi.
And you instantly like stopped what you were doing. You were so kind. Meeting us. You know, um, and, and again, we just thought you did such a great job hosting throughout the whole conference and it wasn't just like you on stage. That was great. It was you between the stages talking to people and you won Best Dress award as given by Kim.
I was like, she wasn't
Speaker 2: just the best host. You won an award, Dean Goodness by us. Goodness. You did by Kim. Yeah. Tell [00:03:00] what you wore to win that award. Catherine.
Speaker 3: That's so kind. I think it really goes to show you never know what someone's thinking inside versus, or like thinking or feeling versus how they look on the outside.
I'm very glad you thought I looked focused on my laptop.
Speaker 4: I'm sure I
Speaker 3: was like, oh God, what did I forget to say? Did I make any mistakes? Blah, blah, blah. And I would not have known, for instance, that Kim was feeling a little starstruck or shy or whatever else. That's great. As a fellow extrovert, I feel that so deeply though.
'cause my shy probably still looks like other people's extroversion. I find myself blabbing a lot.
Speaker 4: It makes me think
Speaker 3: of Anna Kendrick. I think she plays those roles so well. Yes. Yeah. But when I think of myself, people are like, oh, you're so outgoing. I'm like, I'm just really nervous. Have you noticed I'm talking fairy fast
Speaker 2: and you just spit it all out?
That didn't come across like too fast or like, you seem very seasoned when you were hosting though, and everyone, like you spoke very authentically for a host. Usually hosts are like, and no, we're [00:04:00] welcoming to the stage, blah, blah, blah. But you were like speaking very heartfelt and thoughtful. Like you were very just choosy in your words.
Like it sounded like it came from your own heart and you built that yourself, which was special.
Speaker 3: Well, that's lovely to hear. Thank you very
Speaker: much. Oh, if travel con's listening, bring her back. Bring her back.
Speaker 4: Thank
Speaker: you. Thank you. Second vote.
Speaker 2: Cool. But yeah, we're excited for today's episode though because we get to dig into your life.
We get to talk about Catherine got started in this space, the emotional impact of travel, that that just goes beyond just points and redemptions and the hilarious, surprising, and sometimes unhinged realities of booking with points. She is the points expert. Um, we've also definitely got a fun. Couple of games for you of course, because I promise and you were pumped about it.
But I'm definitely hoping to bring out your wittiness and some fun stories too. So, and,
Speaker: and I'm very excited. 'cause like I, I [00:05:00] consider us travel experts. We've traveled full time for seven years, extensively all across America, all throughout Europe. And yet neither Kim or I have ever booked a flight or a hotel on points.
Literally have never, never used points once. That's, that's really
Speaker 3: impressive. I find that very impressive. So I thank you. I would love to hear more of that too, because I think people are always wondering how to travel and the default answer is always, well use your points, but I love that and I want to hear more.
Speaker: Yeah. And well, and I want to hear how to use points because, you know, we've used Airbnb really extensively for lodging, but you know, the cost of Airbnb have skyrocketed in the last couple years to the point where like, hotels are starting to atch up with the, the cost. And I'm like, well, I really need to start using points to save, save some money when in between our Airbnbs, uh, and everything like that.
So yeah, we're excited to, to learn a lot more. We, you know, use our business credit card all the time. So it's like, why am I not using this sufficiently, you know?
Speaker 2: Oh, I know. We're [00:06:00] probably gonna make your ears hurt a little bit today,
Speaker 3: Catherine. I don't think so. I'm always so fascinated by what people do.
One of my favorite things about this current era in history is the way we can all talk about our money and our life choices a little bit more freely. 'cause I think it keeps us from, you know, for instance, everyone gets paid better if we can talk about our salaries and everyone can travel better if we talk about the different ways we diversify.
So I love hearing that and there's never such a thing as. Too clueless to travel or too whatever, you know, like yeah, you probably relate. So, yeah, definitely.
Speaker: Yeah, you have to jump in and you gotta make some mistakes. You know? We've certainly made some mistakes, but we've also found while traveling, the universe loves it when we travel.
Like things just align, it seems like when we travel. Yes. It sounds like for
Speaker 2: you too. Chaos happens
Speaker: sometimes, but yeah,
Speaker 2: it's like, oh, there's a giant storm watching it split in front of you and a rainbow pops up and you're like, thanks universe. Thanks for making this work out. It's awesome. Alright, so let's start with [00:07:00] you then, Catherine.
'cause I, I want our listeners to definitely like hear and understand like your background, where you came from, the origin story, right? So you've really built a career around like helping people travel more. For less. But what was your first like aha moment when it comes to points and miles that made you realize like, dang, this could be life changing?
Speaker 5: Yeah. Um, I, let's see. I was born at a very young age, which is one of my favorite. Everyone was,
Speaker 4: everyone was,
Speaker: I wanna use that. That's, that is a hilarious quote. That's kind of
Speaker 3: what I did too. I heard someone say at one time and I was like, oh, that's so good.
Speaker 4: That's fantastic.
Speaker 3: Uh, I think this is a common experience for children who are first or second generation children of immigrants.
So whether you were born in the US or any other country that is not your parents' country of origin, uh, you end up finding that your family's idea of vacations are actually just trips home to see extended family. Mm-hmm. So, like many other [00:08:00] people in my situation, there are millions of us around the world.
Um. I spent my first birthday in Taiwan, actually. So my parents are both from Taiwan. They came here as grad students, had me, I call myself a PhD baby, which I don't have a PhD, but I have several friends whose parents also seem to have just in the midst of an unlimited, just the endless gr grind of working towards your PhD.
They're like, know, why don't we throw a newborn into this thing? So I spent my first birthday in Taiwan. My dad was back in the US working on his degree, and my mom took me, there's a photo of me like screaming because I'm not seeing all of my family. I, I'm a big daddy's girl and he wasn't there. So the only person I wanted to hold me was the brother who sounded the most like him.
Mm-hmm. So my uncle and I got very acquainted on that first trip. Aw. Fast forward about nine years from there. Um, I'd grown up in Texas until that point. My parents decided to move to Taiwan when I was 10. So [00:09:00] all of us checked there, me and my three younger brothers. And as a very American child on the inside, I suddenly had this big culture shock where people also considered me very American in Taiwan.
So I learned a ton about my culture, but you know, it's extremely expensive to travel back and forth, uh, internationally, especially at that time. So I only came back to the us Uh, let's see. I would say this whole average between birth to college, I traveled internationally between the US and Taiwan at least once every two to three years.
Speaker 4: Hmm, okay.
Speaker 3: So that stayed pretty consistent all the way until I was in my late twenties when I kind of stumbled into credit cards. Um. Actually alongside of an ex-partner who ironically does not enjoy traveling and does not use his points. But I'm so grateful that he got me my first credit card and I'm still an authorized user on his card, which has been almost a [00:10:00] decade since that relationship ended.
Wow. It's very nice. He kept me on it because that's the longest Thank you. Part of my credit history, uh, that first aha moment for me was probably when my grandma passed. Um, I think she was 98, so it was Wow. A very, very good life. There was nothing beyond, uh, like everything was resolved beyond just, we'll miss you, but it happened right around Thanksgiving time in, I believe, 2013, and as a result, none of myself or my siblings were able to make it to Taiwan for the funeral.
My parents had no expectations. It wasn't a guilt trip kind of
Speaker 4: thing. Yeah. But
Speaker 3: I was just about to start a new job, so I had some downtime. And I remember looking in my account and thinking, I wonder what I could do with these points. I think I'd gotten it from the Chase Sapphire Preferred and I'd just been earning them up until that point.
So I took a peek and it was my very [00:11:00] first redemption. I think I went through Chase, um, transferred my points to United, had no idea what I was doing, but I booked a flight, uh, during Thanksgiving, which would've been about maybe a couple thousand dollars in cash, which for someone who was making about 40 KA year at the time, yeah, really, you know, that's a sizable chunk.
5% of my. Pre-tax pay. So I didn't tell my parents I was coming. I asked my parents for their wifi so I could connect on my phone outside the house. 'cause it was before we had internet filming. And I called my dad and was like, Hey, can you check the front door? I said, you something. And when he saw me again, I'm a daddy's girl, he was like, oh my goodness, you're here.
And he actually teared up and he forgot to hang up the phone. Aw, it was very cute. I wish there had a video of it. Um, and so those kinds of magic moments are the ones I actually live for. Like, I think travel is phenomenal and I love seeing new places in the [00:12:00] world. But for me, I am first and foremost, always a loved ones girly.
I will spend points, I will gift points to people to get them places that are meaningful, even above, you know, memorable or uh, aspirational or fantastic.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Gosh, what an amazing story. Yeah, and it, it's interesting you say that to Catherine because now that you've said it out loud, I can absolutely identify with myself, and I'm curious about you, Isaac, but every single vacation.
That I took as a kid was a trip from Indiana to Arizona. We would fly there, it would be like, wow, we're going on vacation. But in reality, we were visiting my grandparents or we'd be visiting like aunts and uncles that were out here, but I always saw it as a vacation. But you're, you're right, like we're taking family trips that feel like vacations.
Did you do that to Isaac?
Speaker: I would say almost all my trips were that, um, to New Jersey, DC family to California to see family. I have one exception and my dad would bring me to Bread and Puppet every year. [00:13:00] So this is a very unique, uh, unfortunately, I actually think it may be starting up again, but it was like this, this company that put on this massive circus in this field in Vermont and my dad has ran the International Mask and Puppet Museum, so, you know, very involved in theater.
And so,
Speaker 2: which means Isaac is a professional juggler and has. Stilted since he was like five and eight. I
Speaker: didn't learn to stay till eight. Um, what a loser. But I just still remember being there 'cause they called it Bread and Puppet because it was a free, uh, circus. But they sold bread and they had this old school like bread mill machine.
And as a little kid, I loved milling the bread. I don't know why I was so fascinated with just like turning this crank, but I loved it. And so I'd just go and mill the bread for hours there while they were, you know, practicing the circus and everything. And then my dad took a lot of influence on that launch circus camp in New York and that was for, uh, eight to 14 year olds to come.
And, uh, they spent two weeks learning circus skills and then would put on a circus at the end of it. And [00:14:00] I was obviously part of that and uh, became the juggling instructor later in life. And, uh, yeah.
Speaker 2: And they would even give the kids, which I think is really cool. I'm gonna note it, but even the kids who like weren't great at juggling or weren't great at a specific something, you guys always found a way to.
Still, like put them into the show somehow. Well, right.
Speaker: I was kind of unique. I, anyone who was in my juggling class, I put in the juggling act, but that's not normal. Yeah. All right. All right. But like I put 'em in as penguins or octopi, we have an octopus, you know, or, or like stilting birds or whatever, you know.
Oh, you can't juggle. We'll be a penguin.
Speaker 5: Yeah. I love that.
Speaker 3: That makes me very interesting of like the, uh, love actually. Where the child is, the nativity lobster and Oh yes, yes. Character's like the nativity lobster. This
Speaker 4: is so funny. There's no
Speaker 3: lobster made it in, but I love that. You know, at that age, who cares?
I'm in it. That's all that matters. Like, inclusivity is so important. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah. That was the really, the only trip I can think of that was really outside, aside from the occasional my mom brought me, [00:15:00] um, to like, um, Washington, DC you know, and that, that was pretty cool. But I actually had no clue what National Parks were until I was like 27.
I had never been to one. Um, and you know, we went to, Kim and I went to the Grand Canyon together, which we just did a podcast on, and that will be released pretty soon. Um, and uh, and even that one didn't like start our quest because like everyone started the Grand Canyon, so we expected it to be epic. I didn't even know it was really a national park.
The next park we went to was actually Bryce Canyon. Um, and we didn't plan on going there. It just like. What we had hoped to do that day didn't happen. So we went to Bry instead. And that was what kicked off our whole quest of hitting up the 63 national parks. Because we went there and we're like, whoa, what is this?
Like, it's a massive sandcastle we're walking into, like, this is unlike anything I'd ever seen. And I was like, is every national park like this? And the answer is yes. Every single one is epic and every single one is different than every other national park.
Speaker 2: And every single one feels like you're on a different planet instead of a different country, which is [00:16:00] bonkers.
So,
Speaker: so that, that Bryce, Bryce for us was like, what changed our lives? 'cause like after going to Bryce, uh, canyon, we were like, okay, we need to literally change our entire lives so that we can set up a system so we can visit all 63 national parks.
Speaker 2: Yeah. And speaking of life changing things, Isaac, I know you had a specific question for Catherine.
Did you wanna ask? I put you on the spot.
Speaker: I'm not sure where we're at. Right here.
Speaker 2: It's highlighted so you can see where we're at.
Speaker: Uh, so one of the things that we're really fascinated with is how other people have been able to essentially get the finances to be able to travel. You know, Kim and I did it by building a business and systemizing the business, but we found that there's so many other people who've done it different ways and we're so fascinated by that.
So for you, like where were you able to align your passion for travel with your expertise and actually like, be able to make money or be able to use your points in a way that allowed you to start traveling
Speaker 3: a lot of trauma?
Speaker 4: That's probably
Speaker 3: not the [00:17:00] answer you were expecting, but I think it's a pretty common one you'll hear from a lot of people.
Uh, usually there's a big life change. If your life is fantastic, you're fairly unlikely to just say, screw it, I'm gonna start all over again and do something different. Uh, but I started my career in tech and. I was going through some transitions at different times. I had some toxic work environments. I ended up juggling like many of us do, and simultaneously the points guy posted a shout out for, uh, part-time contributors.
So I decided to apply. I had zero relevant experience at that point. The only time I'd written an article, uh, let's see, I'd written them quite a bit in college as a journalism graduate, but you know, you think you're not gonna use that degree, and I didn't follow up at all. So they asked for a few different writing clips to showcase.
Uh. [00:18:00] My past work experience and I was like, you know what? I really want this gig. I think it'd be really fun. So I made them a whole landing page. It's still one of the things I'm the proudest of in my whole life. I spent probably 30 hours on this thing, enlisted my roommate's help, she was so kind. Uh, but over the course of five days I learned a whole lot about being not as much of a perfectionist.
'cause I was like, I have to learn how to code a website and all this stuff. And she's like, no, just use Splash that the events planning page. And I was like, would not have thought of that.
Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: So. I kind of, uh, this is one of those, look back and see how much you learned kind of things. But at the time I didn't realize how pivotal that week was for me to gain the confidence that I could try something different.
'cause I didn't see it as, Ooh, I'm going into this new chapter of life. It was just one of those, oh, this is interesting to me and I don't think I'm gonna make it, but I might as well try. Yeah. And I'm one of those people who often will only do something if I know I'm [00:19:00] gonna win or I can do it perfectly or whatever.
Speaker 4: And
Speaker 3: I've learned a lot in this last decade about, uh. Done is better than perfect. Yes. So this was a great example. Uh, months later after I ended up getting the gig, they told me, uh, yeah, you really stood out because you followed all of our instructions to the t. So read all the fine print that screened out like 10% of people to begin with.
They told me. Uh, but out of 400 people, they only spoke with and ended up working with 10 of us, I think. Um, and so that was something that I wouldn't have had gratification for right away. And it was really nice to hear that feedback later on. Not because I mean it as, oh, I'm so great, but just, Hey, you could to again, to our point actually about how you look versus how you're feeling inside.
Uh, I would've thought I am absolutely not a good fit for this, but that's because I was going off of what I thought their expectations were and they were just looking for somebody who is passionate and [00:20:00] dedicated and willing to learn, which I think is the case for anything. You know, you are getting into this podcasting, trying out new software.
You're learning how to travel and work full-time. You're learning how to run a business when you don't have consistent internet or even a home necessarily. Yeah. So no one knows how to do a lot of the things that are coolest in our current generation, but it's never been a better time to try. 'cause we have wild opportunities to do things that our parents could never have thought of or we couldn't even have thought of 10 or 15 years ago.
Speaker: Yeah. That's amazing. And, and you really hit on a, an important point that like has become like very prevalent in our lives and just teaching. And one of the things I always teach when I'm doing, uh, you know, a talk is I say the perfect entrepreneur is the broke entrepreneur. 'cause they never put anything out.
Um, you know's such a good
Speaker 2: soundbite.
Speaker: You know, that's, that's something that I still have to work with. I have very high expectations, but I've just learned if you're doing something that's better than not doing anything, and if you keep taking steps, you're gonna [00:21:00] accomplish something great. So, I mean, I think you really hit on that with what you were talking about there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. And you know, you're known as like the points expert. Now what's the nickname that I gave Catherine? Remember? It was really good. We actually know someone named Hand fan, the internet man. And uh, so I kept calling you like cat fan. Uh, the, the points queen. I don't know. It's not very good now.
I don't know what it, it's, think of it. I'll let you know. But essentially like you are the points queen, right? Like you have all this expertise, but can you talk to us about like what were some of your earliest mistakes or like misunderstandings when you first started getting into using points and Miles?
Speaker 3: Honestly, I still like hearing when people fail, so I'll give you one of mine too, but I still make these mistakes from time to time. The biggest one is often, uh, if you sign up for a credit card and it has a welcome bonus, you forget something to do with meeting all the requirements for it and then you don't get your bonus.
Ah, it happened to me no more than maybe 18 [00:22:00] months ago. I was so annoyed with myself. Um. But that's probably a good one. Uh, you know, I don't miss flights very often anymore, but I definitely have missed, missed some crucial ones in my life. Oh, here's a funny one. Uh, so I'm a big magic moments person, and when I was living in New York City, my parents were still overseas, so I was basically mom to my younger siblings for a couple of years, and one of them was graduating college.
So, so proud of myself. I, I had already been flying home to Austin once every couple weeks, uh, from New York at that time. Thank you. Southwest and a now discontinued direct flight between Newark and Austin. So I flew that route, I would say once every two to three weeks to begin with, but I had to book one outside of the cycle for this graduation event.
I'm so proud of myself. 'cause historically I've been very, very A DHD. You know, I'm kind of a show up at the [00:23:00] last minute. Hopefully I got everything I needed if I didn't, oh, well, kind of person. But this time I was like, man, I am so on top of it. I'm so early, you know, like there's no line for checking in.
And then I was like, there's no line for checking in what is happening. Yeah. So if you know anything about New York City, I had gone to the wrong airport. I went to Newark. Oh. Which we usually went to. But what I actually needed to go to was LaGuardia. And at this point it was already too late. I was gonna miss the JetBlue flight, I believe I was on.
So I ended up buying a ticket. For Newark the next morning, slept in the airport. I think it's the most I've ever paid in cash for a one-way flight. I think it was $800 and I landed just in time to, I missed most of the ceremony, but I got there a couple minutes before he walked across the stage. Oh. Which in some ways still feels like a win because I don't enjoy sitting for a graduation day.
Speaker 4: That's so funny. I cut
Speaker 3: the walk, I'm in the photos, and that's what matters.
Speaker 2: It sounds like you got there with [00:24:00] perfect timing. Actually,
Speaker 3: my six hours. Spent sleeping in the Newark Airport outside of security might argue differently, but you know what, yeah. I was wrong and I'm grateful I had the money to buy that ticket.
Still, I kind of felt like a badass for that actually.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Right. Yeah. And also grateful you had the ability to sleep in an airport. 'cause not everyone can do that. I've never slept in airport. I mean, I would though. I can sleep anywhere. You can, you can sleep anywhere. Yeah. You put me on the floor in the podcast studio right now, I can sleep.
Speaker: You throw a blanket over her, she's out. I'm out. That's a problem. That's great. I,
Speaker 3: you know, I kind of feel like that's, it could be seen as a challenge for a relationship and therefore it is good relationships that can survive that because Yeah, it, it hopefully one person has a lot of, um, compersion and is like, oh, I'm so happy that you're sleeping.
At least maybe tomorrow when I get there, I'll nap and you take care of things. Or you could just be staring or being like. Why, why do you got to do this? That's not fair. I get
Speaker: jealous, but it's honestly really good 'cause I'm a light sleeper. If [00:25:00] she was also a light sleeper, no one would be sleepings. So the fact that she's a heavy sleeper and I can toss and turn a bit and not wake her up, I think it's actually excellent.
And uh, I just need to be able
Speaker 2: to wake up when he is like choking in the middle of the night. Like I need to like change my brain to be like, trigger, trigger. I straight up started
Speaker: choking hard one night and I look over at Kim, she's just passed out and like I was almost about to like hit her to be like, wake up, I need your help.
I'm dying. Don't you care? And I couldn't believe she slept through the whole thing of me, like choking hard directly next to her. I've also slept through
Speaker 2: earthquakes, tornadoes, like just not the best, but also like, why do you think I'm so chipper all the time? Like I get amazing sleep. She does all the time
Speaker: is a
Speaker 2: benefit.
Speaker: So I'm jealous, but I'm also happy.
Speaker 2: I'm happy too. Yeah.
Speaker: I'm
Speaker 3: glad you're happy, Kim. Thank you, Catherine.
Speaker 2: So, yeah. Um, I definitely wanna talk about the whole point system, right? Like, we're new to points, I guarantee many of our listeners right now are new to points or miles, or what the heck [00:26:00] does that even mean, and how do we use them?
So what's the best way for, for travelers or people interested to start getting into using points? What are some like key basics of what, what we should know?
Speaker 3: So I would say the number one thing about points of miles. Obligatory disclaimer. Always make sure you're really responsible with your finances.
It's, I personally don't think it's ever worth getting into debt to travel. Um, maybe rare occasions are, you know, those life changing moments for friends and family. But honestly, I would say even for the two scenarios I've mentioned here, my grandma's funeral and my, uh, brother's graduation, I don't think those are worth going into debt for if you're gonna catch someone before they pass, that's a different story.
But, um, those are still strong wants, even, even though they feel like needs. So that is, uh, statement number one. And the reason I bring that up is because a lot of times people are like, oh, just get a points credit card. It'll be fine. No credit card is not free money.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Um, and I
Speaker 3: think a [00:27:00] lot of people know that, but we don't always feel that.
So very good reminder, even for myself, it's always tempting to be like, whoa. Um, and then beyond that, I would say, um. There are many different types of points and miles. So think of them a little bit like currency. Uh, the US dollar is. Uh, very universally accepted in a lot of places. So that's what I would equate Chase points to am mix points to.
So like the US dollar, the Euro, something like that. You know, in a worst case, pinch, you can pay with dollars in Mexico and they'll take it no problem. You could pay with that lots of places in the world. Um, but if you go to say Taiwan and you have new Taiwan dollars, I can't really use that elsewhere. I can't even use that in China.
Maybe some people will accept it as a one-off for me, but um, I can't use those elsewhere. I would equate, uh, airline miles, hotel [00:28:00] points to be more like that. They're specific to that particular company. And even though Marriott, for instance, have 10, has tens of thousands of, that's not quite right, it's like thousands.
More than 10,000 I think.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Even though they have thousands of hotels, um, I can't use those points at a Hilton. So even though Hilton has several thousand hotels as well, they're gonna be like no dice. So I typically recommend newbies start with rewards that are flexible. So again, you want the Chase points, the City American Express, um, capital One, Wells Fargo.
Those points can be transferred to many different partners and each credit card company has their own partners. So Chase, for instance, very famously partners with both, um, Southwest and United Amex partners with Delta and Citi. Uh. They don't even allow transfers anymore to American ex, uh, American Airlines.
But yeah, we'll stick with Chase and Amex for examples. [00:29:00] Um, there are many different ways you could book a Southwest flight with an Amex card, but you cannot directly transfer your Amex points to Southwest. So these are important to keep in mind as well when you're thinking about how to use your points, make sure you're not going for a flashy card that you can't use very often.
Uh, one example I will give is the Platinum card from American Express. Everybody knows about it. It's the swanky, fancy, very expensive, uh, card. However, if you don't have any Amex Centurion lounges near you, you're almost certainly going to overpay for this card because mm-hmm. If you don't fly through an airport with that lounge, it doesn't matter that you have that benefit.
Speaker 2: Yeah, sure.
Speaker 3: Similarly, um. Austin is a great example. We don't have any lounges right now that are not tied to an airline. So even though I have a Chase card, I have an Amex card and I have a Capital One card. None of those cards are valuable to [00:30:00] me in my home airport. And most lounges now will only allow you to go into the airport when you're departing.
So that means half of my flights, I don't have lounge access when leaving Austin. So these are all important considerations to think about. Um, I would say most importantly, even like I mentioned with points and credit cards in general, think about your needs first. Not your wants. Your wants are many and plentiful and much more fun often than your needs.
But for most people, a good basic card to start with, that's the one you want. Um. And actually coming back to what I mentioned earlier about my first credit card, which is under my ex's account, um, your first credit card is particularly important because it's the one that's going to dictate how long your credit history is and your, your entire credit score is anchored, at least partially on that.
So be very careful. Don't get a million dollar a year credit card. That's gonna be very [00:31:00] difficult to justify if your financial circumstances change at all. I'm a really big fan of no annual fee credit cards for this reason. So you can just keep it long term, not think about it. Even if you don't use it.
It's good to have those around. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Speaker: Very cool.
Speaker 2: Really good insights. Thank you.
Speaker: Yeah. And I wanna, uh, jump into some other things, but I know we have a game coming up. So should we play the game and then jump into, 'cause I, 'cause you know, you're talking about transferring points off of cards to somewhere else.
I've never heard of that. I've never done that before. Um, you know, that kinda stuff. So I wanna dig into more of that. But let's,
Speaker 2: I like that Isaac's default is like, oh, let's just play a game. Let's play a game
Speaker: and then I wanna dig into this and I wanna learn what I'm doing wrong. Alright,
Speaker 2: so before we get into the juicy bits, um, we're gonna play a game called Points, or Nope.
Where Catherine, this game is all about you. We're not getting involved in this one. So I'm gonna describe a scenario [00:32:00] and you have to say points as in like, yeah, I would definitely do this on points, or maybe I already have used points on this. Or like, heck no. Like, definitely not Kim. This is a terrible reputation.
Okay. Do
Speaker 3: you want like rapid fire responses or do you want me to explain my why?
Speaker 2: If there is a why behind it and, or like a real experience based on the scenario I'm sharing. You can give a little snippet on
Speaker: each one. Yeah. I would say if you feel like dropping a knowledge bomb yes. Drop your knowledge bomb.
Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's right. All right. So the first scenario is business class to Bali, but your seatmate is an influencer filming the entire time.
Speaker 3: I'd book it on point. I don't wanna pay that kind of cash to be annoyed, but I'm also the kind of person who would go over at some point and be like. Hi. Do you mind being quiet?
And if I don't feel like it, because I don't know, it's like a terrifying looking influencer, I would ask the flight attendant to do it.
Speaker 4: I've gotten so much better at
Speaker 3: speaking up in general, especially if it's gonna be something I will be annoyed at [00:33:00] or resent. And someone's breaking the rules. Mm-hmm. So breaking the rules.
Yeah. It's all part of my i that person.
Speaker 2: You like breaking rules or you don't? No, I, I am a rule follower hard,
Speaker: such a rule follower. It's just like
Speaker 2: in my being I
Speaker: had to like teach her like, okay, some rules are flexible.
Speaker 2: Ah, I see the troublemaker of, look, he's not sleeping. I can see why he went rogue. He has a strategy brain.
He's like, is it more efficient to do this or this? Or like, that's a circus child right there. Oh, that's a
Speaker 4: circus child.
Speaker 2: I mean, look, circus is not rule following. I lost gran. This goes to efficiency where I'm like, I don't know. I'll just be the sheep. Let me follow the longest line 'cause that's where everyone is.
Like I just, I can't help it. We
Speaker: were, we were going into, um, petrified Forest National Park here in Arizona, an incredible place. But we got there and we didn't realize that they actually closed their gates at 5:00 PM or 6:00 PM depending on the season. And most national parks are open 24 7 'cause there's camping, but in, they don't want you stealing the pet dried wood.
I understand that. Yeah. So [00:34:00] we get there. We'd just driven. Five hours to get there, and the gates were closed and we're sitting there like, oh, God,
Speaker 2: contemplating our lives. Like, what do we do? What
Speaker: do we do? Sat there and our thinking and, and somebody was leaving, and so the gates open and I was like, Kim, drive in, drive in.
She was like, she was like, she's like, oh my God, but what if they catch us? I was like, we left to leave. That's all. They're just tell us to leave. So I just gased it. I didn't,
Speaker 2: I, I technically didn't break the rules. Did I break the rules? I don't know. The gate was open at the right time. Right.
Speaker: So we got it.
We got to hike like an amazing trail. And then, uh, about an hour after being in the park, they came outta the loudspeakers and we're like, Hey, everyone left in the park, please leave. And they, we
Speaker 2: yeah's perfect. It's time to leave the park. And I was like, okay, should we run? And Isaac's like, no. They just gently told us we need to leave.
We can gently head out.
Speaker: Right, right, right. Yeah. Funny. So yeah. Bending the rules. Right, right. All right.
Speaker 2: Next scenario. A Marriott property in rural Kansas that used to be a funeral home. I [00:35:00] feel
Speaker 3: like a lot of these, you're actually asking me if I would do them, period. Um, I would probably, I honestly would probably use points because a, if it's an consumer really rural, it's probably my only option there.
And I have personally noticed that rural areas actually charge fairly high cash rates sometimes because they know they're the only options. However, because the big wigs who set uh, points rates for things are just like, oh, you are in, who knows where? It's 10,000 points for the night. I love a good deal.
Yeah. Come over ghost. Oh, interesting. You all love a good so deal. You're clearly staying here for free. So,
Speaker: so you're saying that the nightly price isn't necessarily directly associated with the points price?
Speaker 3: It is not. Ooh, that's a knowledge bomb.
Speaker: There it is. I did not know that there's a knowledge bomb.
Speaker 3: And the context there is they're entirely different systems. And so their idea of demand is very different. So [00:36:00] usually when people are talking about, there's a phrase I hate in the points of mile space, but everybody uses it outsized value. So if you hear people talking about, oh, that business class flight to Bali cost would've cost $6,000 if I booked it one way, but I paid 85,000 points on it, um, the average value of a point is between one to 2 cents a piece.
So if you look at 85,000 points, if you redeem it the way that these issuers tell you to do it, like as cash back, basically you're looking at maybe like $850, but that $6,000 business class flying maybe closer to like 2000, 3000, um. It's not at all tied to the value of the points. So it depends. There's a ton of, uh, dynamic pricing and everything.
It's just like, I'm like, but this hotel only cost a hundred dollars on this day and it's $700 today. It's because more people wanna go on that particular day. Yeah. And so they can charge more. Same goes for points. Um, they're two different pricing [00:37:00] systems. Sometimes they overlap quite a bit, sometimes they really don't.
Speaker: Oh,
Speaker 2: fascinating. Yeah. And rural versus city, like, that's interesting. Also, I wanna bring it back to this funeral home because Yeah. Where did you come up with that idea? Um, so technically, I mean, you stay at. All sorts of crazy places sometimes, you know, when you're traveling. Isaac and I actually stayed in a hotel, technically it was a hotel in Fort Bragg, California that used to be an old hospital.
So we stayed in the delivery room and like the door was enormous because I'm sure it used to be like a big swinging door. The sink in our bathroom was enormous. 'cause they used to wash babies in it. Like, and it just, it was an experience. We had a huge window. How are these children, what kind of
Speaker 3: swinging doors are there?
I have many questions, but I just discovered you're more my people than ever because, well. You clearly wanted a good deal.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah. Well, it was a great, I got it for like 60. Sure. It was a great deal. Right. And we had a massive window looking over the ocean
Speaker 5: and Okay. Amazingly it was [00:38:00] super,
Speaker: and there was an article in on the wall about, about like the, the $2 delivery cost of the baby.
No,
Speaker 2: no, no. All right. So like to stay at the hospital back in the day, I don't remember what year it was from. It was like 1942 or something, and it showed the receipt, all the anesthesia, all the days that they stayed there. I think it was three days. They had to stay in the hospital, give birth, all this stuff was $142.
And that was it.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: My sister just had a baby and she told me, woo. It was nowhere near $142. Holy moly. Crazy. Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, so now was actually a very, very cool stay. Yeah, that's
Speaker 2: a cool one. All right. Ready for the next scenario? That's cool. Yeah, please go. A spontaneous trip booked with points where you don't learn the destination until you land there.
Speaker 4: That's scary to go anyway. I guess
Speaker 2: it's hooked on points
Speaker 3: then there's no, it's hooked on points. Like
Speaker 2: is it
Speaker 3: like, uh, would I go or not go if someone else is paying those points? Absolutely. I don't care where you send me. Send Meter World, Kansas in a funeral home or no, I [00:39:00] guess points or, Nope.
Speaker 2: Doesn't say my points.
Or your points or, Nope. Correct. That's right. Your points. Yes. Alright. Last one a night at the park, Hyatt, Tokyo, if you agree to sing karaoke in the lobby.
Speaker 3: No. Done. Obviously I will do
Speaker 2: race
Speaker 3: day, uh, but also I do enjoy karaoke. Of course you do as this.
Speaker 2: Um, what's your go-to song for karaoke? Don't Stop Me Now by Queen.
Oh my God. Yeah. Powerful. Powerful. Like that one. Powerful. I hear it now.
Yeah. I love it. All right, Isaac, you said you're about to get in the juicy stuff now,
Speaker: so like I'm already learning things, but So, you know, I have a couple of credit cards obviously I use all the time. Um, my personal one is a Chase Sapphire. Uh, this
Speaker 2: preferred, preferred, preferred. It doesn't matter.
Speaker: Um, and, and that was really helpful when traveling abroad for no transaction fees, no international
Speaker 2: fees,
Speaker: and, um, the car insurance, which was great.
Didn't we
Speaker 3: have like travel insurance [00:40:00] too? If you hear this sponsor, these people listen to them rattling off your benefits right now.
Speaker: So, so we really, we've actually recommended this to many people traveling and they've all said great card. I think it's an $80 yearly fee. Mm-hmm. But also you're supposed to maybe get like $50 to use in a hotel that I've never figured out how to use.
So like, okay. Something like that. And then my business credit card is the Capital One Spark business. Okay. And this, you know, gets $8,000 to $10,000 a month put on it.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Because of our business expenses with Lofy. So, and
Speaker: I've literally never redeemed these. The only thing I do is I redeem the cash back.
So like, I recently just redeemed like. $4,000 cash back on it. Yeah. Um, but now you're telling me I could have booked 17 first flight tickets to blah, blah, blah and blah, blah. Yeah.
Speaker 3: We're gonna ask you, are you willing to stay at the park, Hyatt, Tokyo, and sing for it because Yeah.
Speaker 2: No, no. Let's s first all Isaac doesn't do karaoke, but I will, I will take, I will volunteer to do that karaoke.
Speaker 3: And this is why it's a good idea to be in a, [00:41:00] a good relationship because look, one of you doesn't sleep and the other one will sing. So
Speaker 4: everyone
Speaker 3: done. And if the singing doesn't work, then you go juggle some things. They're gonna enjoy this. He juggles everywhere we go. Catherine, I have so many, like, I can kind of relate 'cause my brother did that a lot when we were really kids and teens.
I actually could juggle at some point. I'm not very good at it, so I'm, you have something to juggle on? We'll never do it in general, but I have no doubt You are fantastic at it.
Speaker: We, uh, we drove up Mount Lemon with Marina, one of the speakers at Travel Con After Travel Con, which, uh, phenomenal, uh, drive. But she had asked me like previously to juggle, so I like picked up three rocks and just started juggling on the mountain.
Speaker 2: I'm pretty sure you juggled snowballs while we were at the top of Mount Lemon too. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah. I probably have. Um, so okay with using my points, like how, I guess what I don't understand is I've always just redeemed the cash. 'cause I was like, okay, great, I got 4,000, now I have 4,000 and I'll just take the, you know, my flight is $1,500, I'll just take the $1,500 and put [00:42:00] it into the flight.
And I think I've always tried, when I've looked at flights, I've always done it directly through the card platform and it's always the same price as what I find on like Expedia. So I'm like, why go about doing it this way? But you're telling me I have to transfer points maybe, and that's what I'm missing.
I will
Speaker 3: tell you a fun little fact. The reason why you see the exact same price you would see on Expedia is because Expedia powers the Chase platform for travel. Okay. At least I believe it still does. It did at some point. Um, yes. So again, coming back to what we said, points all being worth different things.
And I feel morally obligated to tell you your annual fee on the Sapphire Preferred is $95 a year. Okay. Um, because, and this is kind of helpful to know because there are a slew of really good travel rewards credit cards that are all under a hundred dollars a year. So that one, the venture rewards card, um, why am I blanking all of a sudden?
But now that I've made this bold statement, yeah. So they're all under a hundred dollars a year. So they're all kind of trying to dance [00:43:00] on that line of saying like, oh, you get so much for it. Um, your $50 credit, you can use it through that Chase portal. So Chase travel, you book a qualifying hotel, stay through there, $50 comes right off of your bill.
I think. Let's say you're staying at the park, hike Tokyo, and you pay the $800 or whatever it is, the hotel will still receive the booking as $800. Chase itself will take off that $50 for you so that when you're paying seven 50 your credit card statement. Um, I actually don't remember if it is a statement credit or an automatic deduction when you use that credit.
Um, but either way, these are all technical details. Mm-hmm. Uh, but suffice it to say it is supposed to be very easy to use. Um, so keep that in mind for your next day. Typically, I like to use benefits like that one on a cheap one off. So you're going to rural Kansas just for one night. Go ahead and use it there because you probably don't care about the other benefits.
Like, uh, oh, do I get free breakfast here? Uh, how, [00:44:00] how nice is the pool or whatever. You're just there to stay and use it. And because it's $50, it's not significant enough for me to wanna splurge on, you know, a $800 room. I'm not spending my $50 credit. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So let's go find a rural place first. That, that seems like a, a low ticket.
Like, let's test out this whole points thing first.
Speaker 3: Well, you're technically not using your points for that one. Because you are buying it. Um,
Speaker: but we're booking it through the rewards portal.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Because that's the only way you can use that particular credit. So usually when you have cards that have these types of travel portals or two different ways, you can use your rewards.
You can either book through it and still pay cash or by cash I mean you pay with your credit card. So I'd say I'm booking a hundred dollars hotel room. I can choose to pay a hundred dollars on my Chase Sapphire Preferred and when I check out, I'm just gonna get those bonus credits. Uh, I think you get five points per dollar if you book with a Sapphire Preferred through [00:45:00] Chase Travel because they're incentivizing you book with us, we got a little commission, so we'll pass on some of that savings to you.
Speaker: So if I were to just use my credit card to book it directly, I wouldn't be getting those five x points. I have to book it through the rewards portal.
Speaker 3: If you don't book it through the rewards portal. Interesting. You get two points per dollar on the Sapphire Preferred.
Speaker: Interesting.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah. Okay. And take advantage.
And they're really trying incentivizing. However, you can also buy travel through the portal and choose to use your points to pay it off. And because you have the Sapphire Preferred, you get a 25% bonus. So let's say a hundred dollars hotel room, let's give you the $50 credit. So now you have $50 left to pay.
You can choose to pay for it in cash, and then you'll have a $50 charge on your credit card. But you'll have gotten, uh, 250 points because five times $50. Or you can choose to use your points to pay for it. And because you get that 25% boost, [00:46:00] I think you're looking at. 3,750 do 50 points that you pay for it.
So I kind of like to toggle between the two. If I'm going to book through the portal, I wanna see what am I trying to maximize? Do I have a travel credit I'm trying to use up, um, do I feel comfortable using my points to pay for this or should I use cash? So since you have a business as well, I pay for business travel with my card, I pay for it.
Since I need that receipt, I need to see how much I spent. And then for the personal travel side, I use my points. So it's nice because it making some broad, general sweeping statements here. Your points aren't text typically, so it, and you are allowed to use them between your business and your personal.
So I think the people who come up the most ahead on points and miles are business owners because you can earn. Again, tens of thousands of points per month based on how much you charge and use those for personal travel. So you literally [00:47:00] don't have to pay for anything if you don't want to. I would.
Speaker: And and so what you're saying is that if I just redeem 'em for cash, I get that cash back.
But if I go through the portal, there's a 25% bonus. So essentially I'm getting it, is it 25% off? I'm paying 75% of what I would if I had just taken the cash and then paid for it. Is, am I correct in this?
Speaker 3: Uh, say your second part of that again. You're paying 75% off, so yeah, you're getting a 25%, uh, discount, essentially.
Yes. So if it was $50 and it's one point percent, then I would theoretically need to pay 5,000 points. Right. But because you get that 25% bonus on the Chase Sapphire Preferred, you're paying 3,750. Now, the premium version of that card, the Chase Sapphire Reserve, because there is a big difference. That card gets 1.5.
Time, so it gets a 50% approval. So I would only pay 2,500 points. Gotcha. But I'm paying way more per year for that card.
Speaker: So that would [00:48:00] make more sense as my business card that I'm putting a lot more on every month, uh, you know, to do that.
Speaker 3: Yes and no. Yes, the idea is right, but the Sapphire Reserve is a personal card.
Okay. And I'm very excited for you because Chase credit cards phenomenal for business. I think the Capital One ones are pretty decent. Chase, hands down, I, I'm a big Chase Garley. Okay. And the chase in cards have gotten me more points than honestly all of my other cards combined. Pretty much as Catherine said.
Chase, are you
Speaker 2: listening?
Speaker: Sponsorship? We're
Speaker 2: talking about all the Chase.
Speaker: Yes. Um, so which card do you think you'd recommend for me, knowing I spend eight to 10,000 a month on, on, you know, monthly.
Speaker 3: Yes. If you really, really wanna get into this Points in Miles Game. You should get chase ink cards for each of you, for each of your businesses.
'cause they have really, really great signup bonuses. And I have
Speaker 2: Chase Ink right now actually. Yes, for my, 'cause I'm an independent contractor, so with my LLCI have Chase Inc. Yes. I really barely [00:49:00] use it though, if I'm being honest. Honestly.
Speaker 3: They're so great though. I have over a million Chase points because I have, like, I've opened a Chase card.
Uh, I, I dabble a little bit in real estate, so whenever I have a new property, I like to put my expenses on that one. And, you know, after the initial big wave of spending, hopefully I don't end up having to use it very often, but it's still there. Um, but they have some of the most generous welcome bonuses you can earn.
Like, uh, you can consistently get. 70,000 to a hundred thousand points on Chase Ink cards for signups. Wow. And, um, if you really wanna get into that world, there's this whole concept of P one P two, like video games. So because you're a couple, um, Kim, you can refer Isaac as P two for X card and then he can get, you can get a referral bonus when he signs up.
He'll get a referral bonus if you, uh, sign up on one of his cards. There's a lot of ways you can get him the P one, P two. Okay. Yeah. All
Speaker 2: I hear is I'm [00:50:00] Player one and you're a player two, you said video games. Yeah, I did say video
Speaker: games. Yeah. Um,
Speaker 3: it's a, a good nerdy pursuit for nerds. Yeah, I like it.
Speaker: So that, so that's so fascinating.
I'm gonna have to go and the next hotel I book, I will book through the rewards platform instead and, and like actually do that. 'cause I've just, I've literally never done it. Now you were talking about,
Speaker 3: or I, I will ruin that for you. Also, if you are chasing hotel status at all though, all of these Countess third party bookings.
So if you're booking through Expedia, travelocity, booking.com, um, chase, Amex, all of these, they're all third party companies. Basically. They buy a bunch of hotel rooms in bulk and then pass on some of those savings to you. The problem with that is you're not going to get credit for it from the hotel. So I'm a big Marriot girl as well.
And when I book hotels through Marriott, I don't necessarily get credit for my nights date. I don't get points toward, uh, future stays, which really didn't matter to me at all during the era that I've talked quite a bit [00:51:00] about. I was always like, what is the most affordable thing? I don't care about status and I don't travel enough for it to be worthwhile.
But now that I am chasing Marriott status, it makes way more sense for me to book directly through Marriott because I have way better benefits. Like I get late, super late, checkout super early, check in when available. Um, I get free breakfast and things like that. But if I book through Chase, I don't get those benefits 'cause they're like, we don't know who you are basically.
Ah,
Speaker: so do you still get to use points at all or no? You can't use points? I can, but
Speaker 3: I can only use, again, it's like the, uh, new Taiwan dollars. I can only use Marriott points to book Marriott hotels if I wanna go that way, or I can pay cash. Mm-hmm. So
Speaker: do you have a Marriot card?
Speaker 3: I have free Marriott cards.
Speaker: Okay. See, I don't even know that that Marriott had a card. So
Speaker 3: there are seven maybe. They're definitely six, seven. Wow.
Speaker: So if there's a specific hotel you really like and you consistently stay at, you should, you're recommending that you should probably usually get their exact card and then use that for [00:52:00] purchasing.
Just the Marriot like stays then?
Speaker 3: Yes. Oh, this is a long, deep dive. But the thing about Marriott is it does partner with a lot of, um, these companies as well. So my chase points, I can transfer them to Marriott. Also. So if, let's say, I definitely wanna book Marriott Hotels only, and I definitely wanna chase status, but I don't wanna pay cash for them.
I can transfer my chase points over to Marriott, however, this is where that currency thing kicks in. So Marriott points are about a third as valuable as Chase points. So if I transfer 20 point 20,000 points over to Marriott, I've instantly decreased the value of my points by about 66%. Oh, so, um, if you hear points of miles, people talk a lot about points, hotels, Hyatt offers the best options for those in the Chase world because a point is a point whether you transfer to Marriott or Hyatt.
The Hyatt points are worth about a third. What Hyatt points [00:53:00] are, Hyatt points are valued, I would say, uh, rough, roughly like 1 cent per point, which is a really high value. And you can get rooms for, um. 6,000 to 12,000 points very easily. Whereas Marriott, you'll typically find anywhere from 20,000 to 50,000 is pretty standard and Hilton can be a little higher.
So yeah, there's a whole lot of mental currency that you have to juggle and that's why there's no single option that's best for any individual person or even couple, because your needs are gonna be different. You know what you might wanna book for your business, travel may be very different from your personal travel.
Speaker 2: That's why you said needs not wants. Like I love that you said that. That's another knowledge, bu like know what you need, not just what you want. Mm-hmm. Because I see a lot of value and for us, like having the versatility to have a card that you can use in different areas, whereas like Right, most of my family, they're super high on like, oh, I got my Southwest card.
Yes. So there's their points for Southwest, but then you're just [00:54:00] limited to just Southwest. Right. And I think we recently heard that they got rid of their free baggage. Yeah, great. That that was a big
Speaker: talk at volleyball last night. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Everyone's real
Speaker 3: bummed about it, but yeah. Uh, yes. I think Southwest is, if this is what happens when you get an investor who's really, really driven by bottom line.
So I think all of those people who are really big Southwest fans actually, um, really need to consider how much value they actually get from flying Southwest now because, uh, if you wanna check a bag on every flight, you're gonna need that credit card more than ever. Yeah. And a lot of times the best reason to keep an airline credit card actually is so you can get a precheck bag and so on, so forth.
Oh yeah. I always never trick bags, so it doesn't matter as much to me. Yeah, yeah. But especially for families or people who travel with a lot of gear or business stuff, very helpful to have. Yeah. Good note.
Speaker: So let me, I, and, and I'm probably asking you questions that you're like, this is so obvious, but to me it's just like you're opening up a whole new world [00:55:00] right now.
Stop. I still
Speaker 3: learn every day. So I feel like
Speaker: Jasmine, you know, a whole new world. I know, I hear it in my head.
Speaker 3: I'll take you on a flying carpet. Only five points. I'm there,
Speaker: I'm there. Also, when we come to Texas, we want you to cook us some spicy Chinese food. 'cause that's absolutely, I read that that's a specialty of yours.
So where did you go with this? Well, I, I read it was a specialty, so, um, so, okay, so we can book directly you, and you can book flights directly through your card as well, but you're now talking about transferring points. What does that even mean and how do you go about doing that?
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker: And I guess when is it beneficial to do that?
Speaker 3: Yeah. Perfect. That's a great question. Transferring points is, um, every major card issuer has, uh, a bunch of partners that they work with. Um, the latest example is Wells Fargo, which added them I believe, last spring. And they only have six or seven partners right now, which is much less than [00:56:00] City, American Express, chase, uh, capital One and even built, have more partners than that.
And those are just airlines and hotels that have partnered with these credit card issuers. Many of them offer credit cards through these companies as well. Um, but you, again, like I said, with the Marriot points, I can use my Chase points and transfer them through the travel portal. Over to Marriot. So I wanna book Marriot.
I don't have 50,000 points. I'm like, this is worth it to me. I send my Chase points over there. I cannot send them to Hyatt, be sorry. I cannot send them to Hilton because Chase does not partner with Hilton. And, uh, similarly for say Delta. I love Delta. I love Chase, but I cannot use my chase points to book Delta award flights.
Um, let's see, what else do you wanna know on the travel
Speaker: front? Like how do you transfer?
Speaker 3: Oh, how do you transfer? I [00:57:00] usually have to be logged into your port, uh, your dashboard. So you go into your chase.com, log into your account. Uh, I believe on the right sidebar there is something that says Chase travel.
Um, check to see how much your rewards are worth. And it's important to note. You'll only see that if you have a card that earns travel rewards. If you have only a cashback card, you won't see that. Oh, but you can have multiple cards across all of these. So for instance, Kim, I'm assuming you have access to the Chase Sapphire Preferred.
Card also, like do you have an authorized user card under Isaac? I don't, so Ooh, okay. That one. We
Speaker 2: as a couple, we operate, um, very independently of, of each other. I see. Even though like we've been together 10 years anyways. Yeah. It's just, I don't know. We like it. It's easy. Yeah. Like I have my own Chase accounts then, and I have multiple cards through Chase as well.
The Chase Inc. The Chase Freedom. Um, and then he has his own stuff through his chase, but
Speaker: typically speaking, I'm the one who books and pays for all of the lodging and [00:58:00] travel
Speaker 2: and I drive all the
Speaker 3: time. Yeah. Um, sorry, there's a slight lag here. That's okay. What was the last thing you said? Okay, well, can, um, I,
Speaker: I was just saying that I'm the one who typically books and pays for all of the lodging and travel, so, you know, those would be going through my cards anyway.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay. No worries. I was just trying to see if you had access to both sides of the portal. No need. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so to transfer them, um, yeah, so.
Speaker: And it, it's,
Speaker 3: you'll see an example Isaac for your Capital One portal. You're not gonna see that option because you only have a cashback card. Yeah. The Spark
Speaker 2: is a cashback card.
It's not, it doesn't have travel benefits, so you won't have that. But it sounds like you just log into the chase, you see Chase travel, you click on it. Is there a button that says like transfer points?
Speaker 3: Yeah. Also, honestly, anytime I'm stuck, I just go into Google and type, how do I transfer, blah, blah, blah.
Because it doesn't make sense to keep all of it in your head. It changes all the time anyway. No. Yeah. I usually will [00:59:00] google it, but you can almost always, no, you can always find it when you log into your dashboard for any credit card. Mm-hmm. Um, whether or not it's easy to find is another thing, but it's very easy for all of the major ones.
And especially if you were like a built credit card person. A lot of these more fintechy ones, you can do it directly through your app. Gotcha.
Speaker: And what is the benefit of transferring your, your points aside from just booking directly through the portal? Is it really the chasing a reward status, uh, is the main thing or, uh,
Speaker 3: no, not chasing reward status.
It's, you can get much better value a lot of the time. So that example I gave you earlier of our Bali business class flight, it's $2,800 in cash or 85,000 points. Um, I'm getting, you'll see people talk about this a lot, but like, my value per point or cost per point, cents per point. Any of these abbreviations kind of go to show you that.
Let me do the math really fast. [01:00:00] Mm-hmm. Oh, hope I didn't ruin some 85,000 questions, Isaac. Okay. Yeah. I mean, it's just
Speaker: so fascinating. Um, yeah.
Speaker 3: If I redeem 85,000 points for a flight that costs me $2,800 in cash, I'm getting more than 3 cents per point. Value.
Speaker: So if I'm understanding this correctly, if I were to book through the Chase portal, I would pay the equivalent dollar cost through the Point Chase portal plus a 25% bonus.
Speaker 3: So this is where they're different, paying through the portal is very different from transferring to the partner.
Speaker: Yeah. So
Speaker 3: it's kind of, think of it more as like a bank account. Those are two separate ways to use your points that,
Speaker: so I'm trying to compare the two. Yeah. So if I were to do it through the Chase portal, what does that look like in terms of points?
Speaker 3: So it always is gonna change. It depends on how much that cash value is of that thing, and then also how much the points value is. So there are two ways I could book that business class flight. I can book it through the portal and pay $2,800 and use my points. The, so I'm paying the cash
Speaker: value [01:01:00] that they're saying that it's worth if I
Speaker 3: do that through the portal
Speaker: plus the 25% bonus.
Speaker 3: Correct. But what's the best if I transfer them to a partner that offers that? Flight for 85,000 points. I'm typically getting a way better value when I transfer, so that's why transfer partners are valuable.
Speaker: Gotcha. So you just have to do some quick math and or have may not math. Be very
Speaker 2: slower. That's what I was gonna say.
Yeah. Just chat GPT it and see is it more valuable to transfer these points or to just book it this way. Right. Yeah.
Speaker: Okay. So now I think you've just unlocked a big understanding. 'cause everyone talks about buying things on points, but anytime it went into the portal, it was just the same amount of money that it would be if I bought it through Expedia.
And now you've explained why that is. So, yeah, right. Yeah. Okay. And what's this is making, this is making a lot of sense. This is why I vote
Speaker 2: now. You have figured it out.
Speaker: Well, this is why I've always just redeemed my points for cash. But when I said that at Travel Con, people looked at me like I was crazy.
There were so
Speaker 2: many people at Travel Con with points and miles knowledge. They were like, how do you travel and not use points? [01:02:00] And I was like, I
Speaker: mean, it seemed like 75% of the people there were, that was the main way that they were making money through travel is teaching and talking about points, which was kind of like, like travel con
Speaker 3: is such a weird, not weird.
It is such an interesting Venn diagram though, of different types of people because also a lot of people are also business owners, even if you're a content creator. So when people are like, this is the budget I work with, I'm like, nobody travels on. Like travels endlessly on this amount of cash. There's probably, you know, addit additional revenue streams or other business considerations to go into all of that.
So yeah, I think the thing I've learned over this last decade is nothing is necessarily quite as it sounds. So even like with this points portal versus partners, I'm telling you constantly, it depends, but I Yeah, because it always
Speaker: changes. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah. But there's that term for it. I don't remember what it's called, but it's the, um, proficiency dynamic.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. Dynamic synergies. No, it's that, um. It's like the four stages of [01:03:00] competence basically. Where like you start out knowing you don't know anything and then you think you know something and then you realize how much you don't know and then you finally that the proficiency or competence.
Oh yeah, I know what youre talking about. Well, you know, the more you're gonna be like, there is
Speaker 2: never a
Speaker 3: single
Speaker 2: answer. Yeah. And then as soon as you know it, to your point it's gonna change. Right. And then you have to relearn it again or try and figure it out. Right. Well and to the point
Speaker 3: of your actual business model, that's why it makes sense because if it were that simple, people would just do it themselves.
But it helps to have someone in your back corner who is doing that all the time and like it is just their job to be your consultant, to show you how to make your particular situation work for you. So a lot of people actually in the points of Miles space, do points consulting on the side as well.
Speaker 4: Yeah,
Speaker 3: well you might be like, yeah dude, we have 5 million points.
We wanna go somewhere. We're too busy to think about it. I'm gonna pay you. 200 to a thousand dollars and plan us the best honeymoon, best vacation of our lives, whatever it is. Yeah, we'll just be like, cool and just book it for you. [01:04:00]
Speaker 2: It's a point specific travel agent, that's all it is. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker: But it's fascinating 'cause then, and you're saying that the people spending points save more money paying someone to some use points than they would just redeeming it for cash and spending that cash, which is get more value, right?
Speaker 3: I mean like if people were genuinely, genuinely wealthy, you don't care about your points either.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: You just spend money then, you know, whatever. Right, right. Yeah.
Speaker: So no, very, very fascinating. I'm definitely gonna have to, I'm gonna hop as soon as we get off this, I'm hopping back into my Chase portal, kind of looking into that and figuring out what's going on.
And then you said the ink chase card is the best for business. Is there a yearly uh, fee on that?
Speaker 2: I have no yearly fee on my chase ink. And Catherine said she doesn't like cards as much.
Speaker: I think those circum situations where the yearly fee does make sense, but,
Speaker 3: well, I mean, I think a lot of them do make sense.
My favorite Chase Ink card does have an annual fee. There are four of 'em. Oh, does it? Oh, okay. Yeah, there's four of them. Two of them have annual fees, I believe. Don't get the Premier. It's usually not a great one, but they [01:05:00] are the. Chase Inc. Preferred Premier, the Cash and the Unlimited and the cash and unlimited cards are both no annual fee cards.
Yeah,
Speaker 2: I have Unlimited,
Speaker 3: I believe
Speaker 2: is the one
Speaker 3: I
Speaker 2: have.
Speaker: And and you're saying the, maybe the Premier is the best for like the the larger business spend or the preferred Yeah,
Speaker 3: it can be, but the points are kind of, they kind of hoodwink you. You can't transfer them, you can't use 'em different ways. And if you transfer points over to them, this is technical details we don't need to go into, but I do not recommend the Chase Inc.
Premier for most people. The one I was saying is really good for you is the preferred happy to send you a referral link later.
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely. Send it over to me. Yeah, I'll be your player too. I love
Speaker 4: it. Right. You may have to share just,
Speaker 3: but uh, no, some cards are absolutely worth paying an annual fee for.
Let's talk about the Chase Sapphire Reserve. Even. I would send you a very long article. I'd update from time to time on this topic, but it's. Got a $550 annual fee, but you get $300 [01:06:00] travel credit right off the bat. So that's essentially worth, you know, now you're only paying $250 a year. Yeah. But again, once versus needs, if you don't need to be spending $300 a year on travel, it doesn't matter how great of a deal card is.
But that's a good example of a card that's really worth paying an annual fee for because it has really, really strong travel benefits. But because you do have a Sapphire preferred as well, I say this a lot, but that card also has really good travel insurance. So,
Speaker: yeah, I did that one because you, I did look up the lodges and uh, lounges and we didn't have any lounges in our
Speaker 4: right
Speaker: home,
Speaker 4: right
Speaker: airport.
And so I was like, well, and then the extra cost and you know, again, we don't, so we don't fly a ton. You know, how we really operate is we road trip a lot. Yeah. So, you know, we've extensively road tripped across America and we primarily Airbnb it. So this is why I don't use points a ton. Why is because I, you know, we road trip in Airbnb however we like, you know, we flew to Europe in 23 and spent three months and we did stay at a couple hotels and uh, [01:07:00] you know, a lot of Airbnbs, but definitely a few hotels as well.
Yeah. Um, on that trip and, you know, I was talking to someone at Travel Con like saying like, I, I, I kind of struggle with like longer uh, travel, you know, flights 'cause I do have challenges sleeping. And they're like, right, well you probably wouldn't struggle as much if you were flying a business class. And I was like, God cliche, that's not so
Speaker 3: well.
'cause I struggle sometimes. They're very hot. A lot of the time I've found, 'cause you're farther from the vent and that's the most first world complaint. But I'm like, oh, this is not the magical excursion someone told me about.
Speaker: Yeah, and well spending 18 hours on a, on a flight is, is challenging. But when you can like lean back in your chair all the way and not get kicked, you know, by the people behind you, you know.
Speaker 2: Also, I feel like Isaac and I were like the only people on that flight to Europe that were like getting up and exercising. Like, I don't know how everyone sits in a plane, like in, in normal, you know, everybody else back there and just hold still for that many hours. Like one of my nicknames is Squirmy.
Wormy.
Speaker: Squirmy, wormy. How many nicknames do you have?
Speaker 3: Many. [01:08:00]
Speaker: Okay. No, but I prefer
Speaker 3: points. Queen Squirmy Wormy doesn't have the same ring to it. Yeah, I would say. I think, again, it really depends so much on who you are, because I think I'm a little bit more like you in the sense that I would care more about having a comfortable place to relax.
Once I get there, I can kind of just get through any flight I have had to many, many times in my life, but if you're not a diehard ab geek who adores the experience of flying and everything about it, then don't spend your money there. You know, just like anything, any other resource, don't spend your energy or time or money in a direction that doesn't.
Make you particularly happy. Like, you know, you could spend those 80 versus
Speaker 2: want
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. Exactly. 85,000 points. But you know, you're way better off getting an amazing hotel room for that. Right, right.
Speaker: But I know when we flew to France, you know, I struggled for like four or five days with the jet lag, the lack of sleep that I had flying over there.
And it, you know, it made the first like three or four days, [01:09:00] they really challenging. And if I had been able to lean back in my seat and sleep, it might've been much, much better.
Speaker 2: And he says challenging, but we still kicked ass and did eight. Oh absolutely. Of stuff nonstop. Even while he's like, groggy, hazy, like power napping everyone in a while.
Amazing. You gotta go. You gotta move.
Speaker: All right, so we have one last game to play and then we gotta wrap up. But, uh, all right. Yeah. So, oh, it's way down.
Speaker 2: Nope. We are playing, oh, the most unexpected game where I'm gonna ask three questions and all of us get to participate in this one. It's the most unexpected.
Blah, blah, blah. Okay. And you just answered on, on what that is. So we'll start with what is the most unexpected thing you've ever seen in an airport? Catherine, you can start us off
or I can start us off while you think about it. Shit. Yeah. The most unexpected I've seen in the airport. I think we were in Germany, like when our plane aborted and we had to evacuate and it [01:10:00] was right before we got on that flight. But in the Frankfurt airport, um, they had like an interactive wall in the airport.
Oh. Where everyone could like scan the QR code, I think it was. And then you could join on your phone and you are a paper airplane and you're all flying together. That's really on the entire wall. That's really, yeah. In. And I was like, wow, what We got in on it too. I joined one of those. That's neat. And like it's very just artistic and pretty.
I don't know that there was any goal, but it was nice. It was cool. And it was, that's really beautiful. Yeah. I like it. Isaac, what about you?
Speaker: Yeah, I would say we, um, we were stuck in the Phoenix airport actually for a bit. And there was a whole museum there, which we didn't expect. Oh, that's cool. And so we gotta go through his local art and there's some really cool local art and I just didn't expect it to be a museum.
So while we were waiting and for a flight to eventually be canceled, we got to check out. Oh, right, right.
Speaker 3: At least you were, you were cultured while you were waiting for sale.
Speaker: At least I was cultured.
Speaker 2: Unexpected.
Speaker 3: Yeah. You,
Speaker 2: Catherine.
Speaker 3: Okay. I realized from your question that I must zone out a lot in airports, but I'll say two [01:11:00] things that kind of, uh, don't conform to your question because that's who I am.
The first one that's sort of predictable is the Singapore airport is a marble in and of itself. You could literally hang out there for 72 hours. You can have some of the best food in your life. There's a butterfly garden in it, and many other cool things, like a three story slide. Um, but the other thing that came to mind first was.
One of my favorite times was landing in a plane, not in an airport. Um, when I flew down to Antarctica, I flew over the Drake passage to King George Island, and you land on very packed gravel and it's like all black volcanic lava, and it's very, very cool and
Speaker 4: wow,
Speaker 3: really primitive looking in a very cool Erie way.
Oh, so that sounds so cool. Cool. That was my non-air airport story,
Speaker: and I will say I am a bit jealous of you that you have accomplished something that is a life goal of mine, of going to all seven continents. I did not think
Speaker 3: it was a goal of mine. And then once I got to the point where I was traveling a ton, I was like, why not?
So I have now jokingly said, [01:12:00] I will go to the moon someday. I have honestly no strong desire to go to the moon, but if the opportunity arises, I will
Speaker 2: use, use your points to make.
Speaker: We're at, we're at four of seven right now, so at least I am. I There you go. Catch up. We'll, we'll get, we'll get there and I, I really want to go to Antarctica, okay's a
Speaker 3: whole other conversation.
We'll, we'll, so which four have you been to?
Speaker: Uh. The America, north America. Yeah. North America, yeah. Uh, China, Europe, Australia.
Speaker 3: Okay, cool. Africa, I've really enjoyed so far I've been to three unit and they're all, I
Speaker: have to go visit Kenya. I have a lot of Kenyan friends and they've been telling me I gotta come visit best beer in the world I've been told is in Kenya.
Okay, awesome. Uh, I
Speaker 3: also really, really loved Cape Town. Like I will not stop writing about out to everyone. Um, it is penguin gritty and gorgeous. I would my two words for it.
Speaker: We watched the Penguin documentary that was in Cape Town, uh, with Pat during COVID. It was like a really nice, like, actually like positive [01:13:00] that I will
Speaker 3: say that was one of the most grueling flights I've been on because I worked Okay.
Yeah. Week. I think it was like children's holiday break and I flew from the US over to Amsterdam, which is one of the biggest hubs for it. It's 12 hours in economy and like seats that are not designed for, they're just designed for giant. Um. Dutch people and I'm not, no, I'm just like, the headrest is up here and I'm like, oh God, I hate everyth.
That's funny.
Speaker: It, it's would not common that we hear the seats were too big. That is not a common thing to you in America.
Speaker 3: Well, they were still narrow. Here's the thing. They were narrow and tall and I was
Speaker 2: like, oh man. Oh gosh.
Speaker: Yeah. That's funny.
Speaker 2: That's interesting. All right, next. Next, um, most unexpected.
What is the most unexpected situation that happened in a foreign hotel? Oh, and are we counting hotels as like Airbnbs too? Isaac?
Speaker: I was thinking hotels, hotel.
Speaker 2: All right. What? You started?
Speaker: I'll go first. First. Um, when we, when we landed in France and we, we got a nice hotel in Paris and we went to go lay down and take a nap because, you know, we'd just [01:14:00] gone off a long flight and there was no top sheet.
Whoa. Interesting. And we were very surprised by this. And we were like, where, where's the sheet? It was just like, you know, a duvet, a blanket. So we went downstairs and we asked them for, we tried to ask for a sheet. Now Kim speak, I speak
Speaker 2: French. And literally I was like, how do I piece together the words that make sense for top sheet?
And I did it, and it made sense to me. And they were like,
Speaker: they're like, you don't have a sheet. They're like,
Speaker 2: you have a sheet on your bed. And they're like, well, like, no, we have a
Speaker: sheet. We have a, we would like a top sheet. And, and we come to learn that top sheets are not a thing in France. They don't
Speaker 3: use, sheets are not a thing with millennials anymore either, apparently.
Really? Really? Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, wow. What's their excuse? Millennials. I think you may be talking. Yeah, we
Speaker 3: all millennial.
Speaker: Yeah, we use top sheets for sure. Like we definitely use top sheets. Yeah, you're you're an
Speaker 3: outlier.
Speaker: So that, that was really surprising to me. And just the, it was just funny, the conversation of them looking at us like, why do you need another sheet?
Like what are you, what are you doing? Yeah. Okay. I
Speaker 3: find people on Reddit who will agree with you are millennials, are we [01:15:00] really the last generation to use top sheets, three question marks. And it's pretty funny actually. It's like I accidentally swiped left, blah, blah, blah, right up the top, younger people not using a top sheet.
And it blew my ever-loving mind. Is this really a thing? I know I'm an elder millennial. 84, but, but we still use sheets, don't we?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Long today.
Speaker: Yeah. So it's light, it's comfortable.
Speaker 2: I don't, I don't know. It's less than a blanket, but it's another I cold more
Speaker 3: confused by them.
Speaker: I, oh, I was trying to figure out why French people don't use them.
And based on the Reddits that I read, it's like they find them constricting and they're afraid they're gonna like get wrapped up them while they sleep and like choke. And I'm like, what are you doing while you sleep?
Speaker 2: We need to confirm this with other, like, thought we were French people.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Interesting, interesting one. What about you Catherine? What's the most unexpected situation that you've ever come across? Like in a foreign hotel? Yeah.
Speaker 3: I've gotten to have some really cool hotel experiences, but when I was at the Points guy I pitched going to the F1 in Abu Dhabi that year because why not?
I love [01:16:00] F1. And uh, Brian Kelly was like, yeah, sure, go ahead and have our travel person set it up. And they booked it using his points. 'cause he has a lot, um, at the Ritz-Carlton Abu Dhabi for me. And because he was. Whatever star status he had. I, I think he had Plat titanium or ambassador that year, but they gave me a three bedroom villa, which was really cool.
But I was also working so much 'cause it was both Black Friday here in the US and F1 weekend. So I'm like doing coverage there and then I'm doing like overnight coverage here. So I was like, I wish I had more friends in Abu Dhabi because you guys could have an amazing party right now in my three bedroom villa where every time I leave the room, they brought me more chocolate covered dates.
Oh my God. And I was like, God, there's so much goodness here, but I can't drink from this fire. It was all by myself. On the complete opposite side of that, when I went to New Zealand to chase down a black sand beach, [01:17:00] um, my hotel was. Sold out. And everything in that area was like, my room was double booked.
So I ended up in a rental car and I kind of lost my mind. Aw. 'cause I didn't have any water and everything was closed too. So I was just like, oh my gosh. So thirsty and listening to the sound of the ocean. So listening to water that I cannot drink was very, uh, I was very cranky about that. But then I saw the sunrise and it is one of the most beautiful ones I've ever seen.
Speaker 5: Oh.
Speaker 3: So I was just seeing like, made it a little better. Purple and pink and gorgeous black lava. And I'm clearly still alive, so I guess you can live without for a good while. But
Speaker: water's kind of my, I love New Zealand. It's my favorite place I've ever been to and I wanna take him there for sure. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I don't love being thirsty though, like I'm thi thirsty hearing your story like, but you
Speaker 3: know, it's, there's some common denominator here.
'cause three of my favorite, favorite cities in the world, they're all in the Southern hemisphere. So town, um, Sydney, and I really enjoy New Zealand as well.
Speaker: Yeah,
Speaker 3: nice.
Speaker: And it's really funny, when you get to the Southern Hemisphere, they always say the marketing things. This is the [01:18:00] biggest mall in the southern Hemisphere.
Did you, did you In the southern, this is the biggest thermometer in the southern hemisphere. I heard that all the time in Australia. Crack me up. So
Speaker 2: my, uh, most unexpected situation in a foreign hotel. So the hotel you were talking about, Isaac. We had just gotten to France. That's my first time ever in Europe, like outside of North America.
And, um, we got into our hotel room and what was really shocking to me was, I guess culture shock wise, right? The, the shower. Doesn't close all the way. Yeah. Which I was like, Isaac, I'm gonna get water everywhere. And I'm a real psycho about like if he gets water drips on the floor, like I freak out. Like everything just needs to be dry all the time.
But like I love water. So you know what I'm talking about though, right? Catherine? Like I, most places outside of the US, even like you would say, it has the glass, like the walk-in shower, but the glass only goes like halfway if you even have glass. The one in [01:19:00] France, the glass only went halfway. And it was like somehow the water did not get everywhere.
Well,
Speaker: it does get places. It does, it does get all over the place. I just, they don't care. It is really, really kind of interesting. Yeah.
Speaker 2: That, so that sounds weird for
Speaker 3: me. That culture is very different from place to place. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: A lot of places
Speaker 3: are comfortable with not as hot and not as strong of a stream.
Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3: But like, that's one of the biggest complaints I regularly see on, you know, like, first of all, problem for travelers. They're like,
Speaker 4: yes. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Do they know who I am? Pressure. I'm like, very nice. She's not enough Queen Hotel with 200 years of history. What do you expect?
Speaker 2: Yeah. Right, right. Okay. Last unexpected question.
What is the most unexpected person you've interacted with on a plane?
Yeah, let's think about that one.
Speaker: Mine was a group of people. So I was, um, actually flying to North Carolina. I helped this incredible man publish his book. Um, I, [01:20:00] I don't even have time to go into it, but shout out Larry, uh, buck, uh, 72 is the name of the book. Phenomenal story. Unbelievable man. Um, and, uh, he had actually given me his suite to watch the Syracuse, North Carolina game 'cause he is the head of security at the RBC Arena in North Carolina.
And there was then a massive snowstorm. And so we couldn't fly outta Syracuse. All flights were canceled. We couldn't, I couldn't get there in time. And so I actually drove to Rochester to take the flight and the Syracuse lacrosse team. Also drove over to Rochester to get their flight 'cause they couldn't fly outta Syracuse.
And so I got to sit on the plane with the entire Syracuse lacrosse team and talk with 'em and I, you know, used to play lacrosse when I was in high school. So that was just a funny, cool experience that I didn't expect as I was sitting on the plane, like, 50 guys come in, you know, all trying to fit into this, you know, last minute flight, you know?
Uh, so that was cool.
Speaker 2: That's awesome. I'll say my unexpected situation now that I think about it, is on one of the [01:21:00] trips on my vacation to go to Arizona, from Indiana to visit family. Totally unexpected. My, my elementary school teacher was on the same flight as me and I was like, Mrs. Martin. And she was like, oh, Kim Coates.
And I was like, this is, oh, that's so cute, so odd. Uh, but I was also a perfect student, so it was a good meeting. It wasn't like, oh, that naughty kid. Like, nope, this is just this angel. Yeah.
Speaker: My teachers wouldn't have been as happy to see me, is that I'm getting off this plane
Speaker 3: Chances. Always surprised, but yeah.
But I feel like that actually tends to happen strangely, often. Like you would be surprised how many people I run into in New York City. My theory is because when you have these big, um, general, okay, a great example. My very first time in New York City ever, I'm walking down fifth Avenue and just out of the blue I see a coworker from Austin that I don't know very well.
She just happened to be there as well. And we're just in the busiest part of Fifth Avenue during a Saturday [01:22:00] afternoon, like just so busy. But these places where there's a large concentration of people that like to all go to the same place like your teacher, it makes sense. If you're going home, she's more likely than not.
At least gonna be there. Another random one. Okay. I can't think of a good one for a plane, but I will tell you a random one. This one I love. In 2009, I was studying abroad in Shanghai and I'm just about to wrap up my program. I'm leaving in like two days and there's this massive, massive, um, square. There's like probably a hundred thousand people there.
And I passed a guy who I hadn't seen in years, but it was my childhood pediatrician from Taiwan and. Kind of as he had a dinosaur for his mascot. So literally my siblings and I always called him Dr. Dinosaur, so I could not remember his name for a hot second, Dr. Dinosaur. So I literally yelled that in this square and he turned around and he was so shocked and surprised to see me.
So his kid was about to study abroad, but I was just like, what are the chances? 'cause I That's And he
Speaker 2: recognized you? He did. Yeah. Oh, [01:23:00] that's awesome. I
Speaker 3: know. It was like super, super random and serendipitous moments where you run into like that I think was super unexpected.
Speaker 2: Also. What an unexpected but super awesome nickname.
I know. I know, right? And he was just
Speaker 3: the best pediatrician too. Yeah.
Speaker: That is awesome. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah.
Speaker: Very cool. Well, I know we have to wrap up, but so appreciate you coming onto the podcast, teaching us all these things, dropping knowledge bombs left and right. I'm excited to actually go and check out how many points do I have and what can I use them on my neck.
Yes, yes, I will. I will book it through points and I'll let you know I
Speaker 2: love it. Yes, we report back. So for our listeners, before we sign off, Catherine, like for people who are interested or just inspired after hearing the show, which we hope you guys are, what can they do to learn more from you or how can they connect with you?
Speaker 3: Um, the best way to reach me is typically Instagram. So it is Catherine Fangirling 'cause my last name's fan. Um, and you can read all of the guides. I'm constantly updating on points [01:24:00] of miles at, um, business Insider. So just look for credit cards. My name is probably on it, either as a writer or not editor.
Speaker 4: Yes. Awesome.
Speaker 2: As I've deemed Cat fan, the points Queen. Yes. Don't forget Squiring War.
Speaker 3: Me Extraordinaire Squiring.
Speaker 2: Were A-K-A-A-K-A-A-K. Thank you.
Speaker: I wanna learn more. More of your nicknames because is great. Qui awesome. But thank
Speaker 2: you so much is awesome. Catch up with you and see you chat too. And nice chat.
Yeah. Thanks for being on our show. So you gotta join us on the sign off though. Okay. What is the sign off? So when we give you the queue, you gotta stay with us full-time to travel time. Oh. Can you handle it? Okay. Okay. Okay. All right. Ready.
Speaker: Thank you for listening to Fulltime to Travel Time.
Speaker 2: Good work. Good work.
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